Another fake study

General discussions regarding DNA and its uses in genealogy research

Posts: 2406
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:08 am
Location: Pisa (Italy)
YDNA:
R- Z2110 (KV7Y2)
MtDNA:
K1a1b1e/HQ176413
PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 4:40 pm
Another fake study from Levantinists (Daniel E. Platt et al., Mapping Post-Glacial expansions: The Peopling of Southwest Asia )
They believed to demonstrate that there were three refugia in Southwest Asia (one, in the north, centered around the eastern coast of the Black Sea, the second, with a more Levantine focus, and the third in the southern Arabian Peninsula), but they, after their analysis, had to admit, above all for the believed Middle Eastern haplogroups (J1 and J2), what we know from so long, that the expansion happened from Caucasus, and hope that they will understand what I am saying from so long, that they were before the hgs of the European hunter-gatherers. Unfortunately for them aDNA didn't please their desires (and prejudices). If actually Indo-Europeans and hg. R1b came from Yamnaya (what I don't think) will see next.
I'd be glad that they demonstrated that only 1 R1b1-M18 is in one of these places as in their supplement:
Marker Zalloua Lab Ferri 2010 Arredi, 2004 Robino Cinnioglu Zalloua Lab Zalloua Lab Bosch Battaglia Battaglia Balanovsky Battaglia Zalloua Battaglia Zalloua lab Battaglia ElSibai2009, thi study Chiaroni, Luis 2004 de Filippo Tofanelli Battaglia Zalloua Lab Zalloua Lab Tofanelli Chiaroni Ferri 2008 Tofanelli Battaglia ElSibai2009; this study Chiaroni de Filippo Mohamad Zalloua Lab Chiaroni Zalloua Lab Abu Amero Zalloua2008a,b; this study our Lab ZallouaNP Zalloua2008a,b; this study Tofanelli Tofanelli Chiaroni, Luis 2004 ElSibai2009, this study Chiaroni Adams Tofanelli Tofanelli Cadenas Battaglia Battaglia Adams Ambrozio,Hernandez Ambrozio,Dugoujon Tofanelli ElSibai2009,Haber2011, this study Chiaroni Fadhloui 2011 Zalloua2008a,b; this study Tofanelli
YHRD ISOGG 2011 Afghanistan Albania Algeria Algeria Armenia Armenia Bahrain Balkan Balkan Bosnia_Herzegovina Caucasus Caucasus Chad Croatia Cyprus Czech Republic Egypt Egypt Ethiopia Ethiopia Hungaria Iran Iraq Iraq Iraq Italy Italy Italy Jordan Jordan Kenya Kuwait Kuwait KSA KSA KSA Lebanon Libya Malta Morocco Morocco Oman Oman Palestine Palestine Portugal Portugal Qatar Qatar Sardinia Slovenia Spain Spain Spain Sudan Syria Syria Tunisia Tunisia Tunisia
M18 R1b1a1 R1b1c1 x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x x

Posts: 2406
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:08 am
Location: Pisa (Italy)
YDNA:
R- Z2110 (KV7Y2)
MtDNA:
K1a1b1e/HQ176413
PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2017 8:06 am
Annie Mouse said... http://www.nature.com/articles/srep40338
The key thing about this study so far as I can see is that it is about the genetic history of modern SW Asians. Not the world. I am also not a big fan of STR studies, the mutations are too labile for deep ancestry studies in my opinion. I found the paper interesting but I could not see how they came to the conclusion that there was any kind of southern Arabian refugium or Levantine refugium. It did not fit their own data. Specifically the trees in Figure 2. The autosomal data is not displayed or properly discussed IMO. From Figure 2. J1 was in the Caucasus in the near East neolithic according to their data. Arabia and the Levant are very late off shoots.`Ancient DNA puts J1 in Hungary in 5500 BCE but it this is not apparent from their data, which admittedly is focused on modern SW Asia family lines. So a forgivable omission. It just means no J1 went back to SW Asia. J2 (of more interest in European genetics) was also shown in the Caucasus on the early Near Eastern neolithic and was in North Africa 6kya. No mention of Arabia and the Levantine line is amongst the youngest. J2 was also in France by 4500BCE (aDNA) so clearly it had already hit the Mediterranean genetic spin cycle 5k years before the supposed 1k European age in SW Asian populations. I am going to guess that these 1k year old European J2 lines in SW Asia came back into SW Asia with the first crusades. All SW Asian E1b1b1 is shown as originating in North Africa prior to the Near Eastern neolithic and expanding (Natufians etc) into pretty much everywhere from there. SW Asian "Ëuropean" lines are listed as 10k years. It is not clear to me if this means that European E1b1b1 has been diverging in Asia for 10 thousand years or if more lines migrated into SW Asia reflecting 10k years of mutation elsewhere. My guess is both scenarios are true for this haplogroup. Arabian and Levant E1b lines in are amongst the youngest in this group also. Figure 3 The autosomal k3 analysis seems to be that basis of the refugium ideas but it is based on modern populations and why did they choose K3? It seems completely arbitrary. Plus it is all based on a limited list of population choices. The absence of north africa/Egypt as an option is glaring especially in view of the E1b results. Clearly the haplogroup and autosomal data points to A LOT of Caucasian ancestry in the modern middle east (about half for everyone but some arabians). I found that surprising. In summary So if you focus on SW Asian ancestry ONLY, their haplogroup tree results are believable for these three haplogroups. But so far as I can tell the 3 refugium idea is unfounded and unsupported. January 7, 2017 at 6:37 PM

Posts: 2229
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:43 pm

MtDNA:
U5b2b
PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2017 4:12 am
Gioiello
Any or all regions that were ice free were potential refuges for the people who were forced from their lands during the Ice-Age.

Posts: 2229
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:43 pm

MtDNA:
U5b2b
PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 12:21 pm
Another load of rubbish from ancestry.com.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/ ... opean.html




All Europeans are descended from the post Ice-Age population that Villabruna and Bichon belonged to, including the first famers and the Yamnaya.

Return to General DNA Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests

cron