H13b1b in Sappada (Italy)


Posts: 2329
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:08 am
Location: Pisa (Italy)
YDNA:
R- Z2110 (KV7Y2)
MtDNA:
K1a1b1e/HQ176413
PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 11:08 am
SAP016 16261 16262 16291 16297 146 200 263 4769G H*
SAP021 16261 16262 16291 16297 146 200 263 4769G H*
SAP026 16261 16262 16291 16297 146 200 263 4769G H*

I think interesting that these hg. classified H* are probably H13b1b and find the closest ones in the Tuscan from the 1KG (NA20771) and in JQ704147:
H13b C4107T
H13b1 T11485C C16261T
94. EF660956(Italy) Gasparre H13b1 04-JUL-2007
A263G T310C A750G A1438G C4107T A4769G A8860G T11485C T14182C C14872T A15326G C16261T T16519C
A200G
H13b1b A7403G G11440A C16291T
NA20771
A200G A263G A750G A1438G C4107T A4769G A7403G A8860G G11440A T11485C C14872T A15326G C16261T C16291T T16519C
JQ704147 Behar Haplogroup [H13b1b] 07-APR-2012
A200G A263G 309.1C 315.1C C522- A523- A750G A1438G C3462T C4107T A4769G A7403G A8860G G11440A T11485C C14872T A15326G C16147T C16261T C16291T T16311C T16519C

It seems to me that the Tuscan sample is the oldest amongst them.
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Posts: 542
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2012 8:19 am
Location: Family Line Veneto ( italy ) since ~1600
YDNA:
T1a2-Z19945
MtDNA:
H95a
PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 7:26 pm
Gioiello wrote:SAP016 16261 16262 16291 16297 146 200 263 4769G H*
SAP021 16261 16262 16291 16297 146 200 263 4769G H*
SAP026 16261 16262 16291 16297 146 200 263 4769G H*

I think interesting that these hg. classified H* are probably H13b1b and find the closest ones in the Tuscan from the 1KG (NA20771) and in JQ704147:
H13b C4107T
H13b1 T11485C C16261T
94. EF660956(Italy) Gasparre H13b1 04-JUL-2007
A263G T310C A750G A1438G C4107T A4769G A8860G T11485C T14182C C14872T A15326G C16261T T16519C
A200G
H13b1b A7403G G11440A C16291T
NA20771
A200G A263G A750G A1438G C4107T A4769G A7403G A8860G G11440A T11485C C14872T A15326G C16261T C16291T T16519C
JQ704147 Behar Haplogroup [H13b1b] 07-APR-2012
A200G A263G 309.1C 315.1C C522- A523- A750G A1438G C3462T C4107T A4769G A7403G A8860G G11440A T11485C C14872T A15326G C16147T C16261T C16291T T16311C T16519C

It seems to me that the Tuscan sample is the oldest amongst them.



yes

and more proof that the etruscans where part of the or one of the 45 raetian tribes/people as the etruscans settled in Italy ~800BC, the raetian being in the alps from pre-late bronze-age.
Fathers mtdna - T2b17 ...back to 1860 Bucciol line
Grandfathers mtdna - T1a1e ...back to 1820 Mestriner line
Sons Mtdna - K1a4 ....back to 1840 Tesser line
Maternal grandfather ydna - Ild-P109

Posts: 2329
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:08 am
Location: Pisa (Italy)
YDNA:
R- Z2110 (KV7Y2)
MtDNA:
K1a1b1e/HQ176413
PostPosted: Tue Aug 12, 2014 9:03 pm
stoeni wrote:
yes

and more proof that the etruscans where part of the or one of the 45 raetian tribes/people as the etruscans settled in Italy ~800BC, the raetian being in the alps from pre-late bronze-age.


This is a possibility, but, if based upon these hg. H13b1b, it would be the other way around, because these haplotypes of Sappada, even though belonging to the same haplogroup (but we should do an FMS for being sure), are very far from the Tuscan one, which is ancestral to them for many thousands of years: see the mutations in HVRI of Sappada (16262 and 16267, and isn't tested all the HVRI) and in HVRII (146, and all the HVRII isn't tested).
I'd say, once more, that yours are only prejudices and no knowledge of Genetics and probably also of the rest.
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Posts: 542
Joined: Mon Oct 22, 2012 8:19 am
Location: Family Line Veneto ( italy ) since ~1600
YDNA:
T1a2-Z19945
MtDNA:
H95a
PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2014 6:39 am
Gioiello wrote:
stoeni wrote:
yes

and more proof that the etruscans where part of the or one of the 45 raetian tribes/people as the etruscans settled in Italy ~800BC, the raetian being in the alps from pre-late bronze-age.


This is a possibility, but, if based upon these hg. H13b1b, it would be the other way around, because these haplotypes of Sappada, even though belonging to the same haplogroup (but we should do an FMS for being sure), are very far from the Tuscan one, which is ancestral to them for many thousands of years: see the mutations in HVRI of Sappada (16262 and 16267, and isn't tested all the HVRI) and in HVRII (146, and all the HVRII isn't tested).
I'd say, once more, that yours are only prejudices and no knowledge of Genetics and probably also of the rest.


I do not know why you say prejudices if I follow the ancient historians in their writings and modern archeology in their findings....these, both say the raetians are far older than the Etruscans in Italy.
If you want to say the Etruscans have nothing to do with the Raetians, then thats another matter, but to say the etruscans and raetians are the same can clearly only mean that raetians are far older than etruscans by the writings and archeology

To conclude, you cannot claim an alpine migration for etruscans unless you acknowledge that they are from the raetian group ..........or more westerly helvetic group
Fathers mtdna - T2b17 ...back to 1860 Bucciol line
Grandfathers mtdna - T1a1e ...back to 1820 Mestriner line
Sons Mtdna - K1a4 ....back to 1840 Tesser line
Maternal grandfather ydna - Ild-P109

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