mtDNA K1a21 from the Italian Refugium?


Posts: 2341
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:08 am
Location: Pisa (Italy)
YDNA:
R- Z2110 (KV7Y2)
MtDNA:
K1a1b1e/HQ176413
PostPosted: Sun Aug 11, 2013 8:56 am
The hg. K1a21 is carachterized by these mutations:

HVRI: T16093C T16224C T16311C T16519C
HVRII: A73G A153G A263G 309.1C 315.1C T408a C497T
CR: T6407C T9428C T11017C

But we have fron SMGF these samples from the Far East:
HVRI: T16093C T16224C T16311C T16519C
HVRII: A73G A153G A263G 309.1C 315.1C C497T (from Kyrgyzstan)
and
HVRI: T16093C T16224C T16311C T16519C
HVRII: A73G A153G A263G 315.1C C497T (from Mongolia)
where we may presuppose (if of course after a Coding Region exam they belonged to this haplogroup) that both T408a and 309.1C are the most recent mutation and if the mutation A153G were the most ancient of this subclade owned by the Italian Diana Panara. Also T16093C, not present in Panara, would be a mutation happened during the diffusion to East.

We have an European sample: Mitosearch 6f4ff
Most distant known maternal ancestor on the direct female line
First Name: Anna
Last Name: Rupprecht
Year Born: 1824
Year Died: 1905
Country of Origin: Bavaria/Bayern, Germany
093C,224C,311C,519C 073G,153G,263G,309.1C,315.1C,408A,497T,523.1C,523.2A

HQ637410 FTDNA Haplogroup [K1a] 07-DEC-2010
A73G A153G A263G 309.1C 315.1C T408A C497T 523.1C 523.2A A750G T1189C A1438G A1811G A2706G A3480G A4769G T6407C C7028T A8860G G9055A T9428C T9698C A10398G A10550G T11017C T11299C A11467G G11719A A12308G G12372A C14167T C14766T T14798C A15326G T16093C T16224C T16311C T16519C

Posts: 61
Joined: Wed Mar 14, 2012 4:29 pm
PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2013 3:59 pm
Gioiello wrote:The hg. K1a21 is carachterized by these mutations:

HVRI: T16093C T16224C T16311C T16519C
HVRII: A73G A153G A263G 309.1C 315.1C T408a C497T
CR: T6407C T9428C T11017C

But we have fron SMGF these samples from the Far East:
HVRI: T16093C T16224C T16311C T16519C
HVRII: A73G A153G A263G 309.1C 315.1C C497T (from Kyrgyzstan)
and
HVRI: T16093C T16224C T16311C T16519C
HVRII: A73G A153G A263G 315.1C C497T (from Mongolia)
where we may presuppose (if of course after a Coding Region exam they belonged to this haplogroup) that both T408a and 309.1C are the most recent mutation and if the mutation A153G were the most ancient of this subclade owned by the Italian Diana Panara. Also T16093C, not present in Panara, would be a mutation happened during the diffusion to East.
...............


Hi Gioiello,

I don't think you can call those two SMGF sequences K1a21, unless you have further information. They don't have the required 408a. Mutation 153G is found in several other subclades of K.

Posts: 2341
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:08 am
Location: Pisa (Italy)
YDNA:
R- Z2110 (KV7Y2)
MtDNA:
K1a1b1e/HQ176413
PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2013 10:36 pm
Bill Hurst wrote:Hi Gioiello,

I don't think you can call those two SMGF sequences K1a21, unless you have further information. They don't have the required 408a. Mutation 153G is found in several other subclades of K.


Hi Bill Hurst, I thank you for your response and you have all the situation under your eyes. It seemed to me that 153G were a mutation pretty rare and stable (see hg. X) and that it were unlikely it were happened twice in the same haplogroup. For this I have contributed to pay the FMS test for Diana Panara, who has had only HVRI and II. My hope is that she has someone of the three mutations of the Coding Region for K1a21 and demonstrates that this subclade comes from Italy. Are the other K1a with 153G tested for the Coding Region? And are you sure that they aren't linked anyway with this subclade in heteroplasmy?

Posts: 2341
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:08 am
Location: Pisa (Italy)
YDNA:
R- Z2110 (KV7Y2)
MtDNA:
K1a1b1e/HQ176413
PostPosted: Tue Aug 13, 2013 1:31 am
These are all the samples found on the mtDNA Project with 153G. The first is the ancestress of Diana Panara. I am seeing that there is a sample also from Italy.

113856 Anna Vona, Roma, Italia K A16129G, T16187C, C16189T, T16223C, T16224C, G16230A, T16278C C152T, A153G, C195T, A247G, C497T, 522.1A, 522.2C, 309.1C, 315.1C
154040 K T16093C, A16129G, T16187C, T16223C, T16224C, G16230A, T16278C C146T, C152T, A153G, C195T, A247G, T408a, C497T, 522.1A, 522.2C, 309.1C, 315.1C, 522.3A, 522.4C
129834 Anna Maria Marino: Sicily 1890 K1a21 T16093C, A16129G, T16187C, C16189T, T16223C, T16224C, G16230A, T16278C C146T, C152T, A153G, C195T, A247G, T408a, C497T, 522.1A, 522.2C, 309.1C, 315.1C, 522.3A, 522.4C
138899 Georg Christ, 1655-1712 K1a21 T16093C, A16129G, T16187C, C16189T, T16223C, T16224C, G16230A, T16278C C146T, C152T, A153G, C195T, A247G, T408a, C497T, 522.1A, 522.2C, 309.1C, 315.1C, 522.3A, 522.4C
E12783 K1a21 T16093C, A16129G, T16187C, C16189T, T16223C, T16224C, G16230A, T16278C C146T, C152T, A153G, C195T, A247G, T408a, C497T, 522.1A, 522.2C, 309.1C, 315.1C, 522.3A, 522.4C

N21864 Blanche Melvin b 1909 d.2001 K1a4a1 A16129G, T16187C, C16189T, T16223C, T16224C, G16230A, T16278C C146T, C152T, A153G, C195T, A247G, C497T, 522.1A, 522.2C, 315.1C
N60447 Baud Mouthon,1807 K1a4a1a2b A16129G, T16187C, C16189T, T16223C, T16224C, G16230A, C16245T, T16278C C152T, A153G, C195T, A247G, C497T, 522.1A, 522.2C, 309.1C, 315.1C
N47821 Eva Barbara DeCarel K1a4d A16129G, T16187C, C16189T, T16223C, T16224C, G16230A, T16278C C146T, C152T, A153G, C195T, A247G, C497T, 522.1A, 522.2C, 309.1C, 315.1C, 522.3A, 522.4C
67707 Lillian Garrison 1850, Salem Co. N.J. K1a4d A16129G, T16187C, C16189T, T16223C, T16224C, G16230A, T16278C C64Y, C146T, C152T, A153G, C195T, A247G, C497T, 522.1A, 522.2C, 309.1C, 315.1C, 522.3A, 522.4C
226646 K1c2 A16129G, T16187C, C16189T, T16223C, T16224C, G16230A, T16278C, C16320T A153G, C195T, A247G, C498D, 522.1A, 522.2C, 309.1C, 315.1C
125714 peche smith soux city iowa K2a2a1 A16129G, T16187C, C16189T, T16223C, T16224C, G16230A, T16278C A153G, C195T, A247G, A512c, 522.1A, 522.2C, 315.1C
B3231 Sarah Geers b. ABT 1795 d. between 1847-66 K2b1 A16129G, T16187C, C16188T, C16189T, T16223C, T16224C, G16230A, T16278C C152T, A153G, C195T, A247G, 522.1A, 522.2C, 315.1C

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