Sample VP82 R1b?

Any discussions regarding y-DNA markers, results or questions.

Posts: 130
Joined: Fri Mar 08, 2013 5:36 pm

YDNA:
R1b
MtDNA:
U5
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2016 11:56 pm
Is sample VP82 R1b? If so to which clad does it belong too?

Posts: 2283
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:08 am
Location: Pisa (Italy)
YDNA:
R- Z2110 (KV7Y2)
MtDNA:
K1a1b1e/HQ176413
PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2016 8:18 am
VP82?

Posts: 130
Joined: Fri Mar 08, 2013 5:36 pm

YDNA:
R1b
MtDNA:
U5
PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2016 10:06 pm
VPQ82-Italy.

Posts: 2283
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:08 am
Location: Pisa (Italy)
YDNA:
R- Z2110 (KV7Y2)
MtDNA:
K1a1b1e/HQ176413
PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2016 6:15 am
silesian wrote:VPQ82-Italy.


VPQ82: Invalid user

Posts: 2283
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:08 am
Location: Pisa (Italy)
YDNA:
R- Z2110 (KV7Y2)
MtDNA:
K1a1b1e/HQ176413
PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2016 6:34 am
If you did mean this sample from Apulia, Italy, I put on Ysearch from SMGF
VP8Q2 Picciritto Rignano Garganico, Foggia, Italy
12 24 14 11 11 14 12 12 13 13 13 29 17 9 10 11 11 24 15 19 30 14 15 15 18 11 12 19 23 15 13 12 12 11 13 23 10 14 12 12 15 30 24
and we can compare with these closest ones
2M759 Macak Czech Republic
12 24 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 13 13 29 16 9 10 11 11 25 15 19 31 14 15 16 17 11 11 19 23 16 12 12 11 11 13 23 10 14 12 12 14 30 24
424WG Hollingsworth Armagh, Ireland
12 24 14 11 11 14 12 12 12 14 13 30 16 9 10 11 11 25 15 19 30 15 16 16 18 11 11 19 23 15 12 12 11 11 13 23 10 14 12 12 13 30 24
59J9F Shomo Unknown
12 24 14 12 11 14 12 12 12 13 13 29 16 9 10 11 11 25 15 19 30 14 15 17 18 11 11 19 23 15 16 18 16 35 35 12 12 12 12 11 12 23 10 14 12 12 14 30 24 11 9 15 16 8 10 10 8 10 11 23 23 16 10 12 12 15 8 22 20 12 11 13 11 12 12 12 9 11 15 9 15 12 10 12 13 11 10 12 12 11 10 26 26 19 12
A9FUG Anonymous Turkmenian Bezmein, Ahal, Turkmenistan
12 24 14 11 11 15 12 12 12 13 13 28 16 9 10 11 11 24 15 19 30 14 14 15 19 11 13 19 23 15 13 12 11 11 13 23 10 14 13 12 14 31 24
I could say that it is very likely R-L23-Z2110 like me, for having DYS441=14 from 13, but DYS446=15 is in favour of a subclade like CTS9219, but of course it isn't a "Balkan cluster" for not having DYS385=11-11 and DYS459a=8. If you ask ne which subclade of CTS9219, you ask me too much. It is interesting DYS461=12 from 11 like Shomo.

Posts: 2041
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:43 pm

MtDNA:
U5b2b
PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2016 8:22 am
PSFDU looks like an Isles cluster of Z2103 and has 20 matches. Matching User ID PSFDU on at least 67 markers, allowing a genetic distance of 1 per marker matched above 52.

Posts: 2283
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:08 am
Location: Pisa (Italy)
YDNA:
R- Z2110 (KV7Y2)
MtDNA:
K1a1b1e/HQ176413
PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2016 9:03 am
dartraighe wrote:PSFDU looks like an Isles cluster of Z2103 and has 20 matches. Matching User ID PSFDU on at least 67 markers, allowing a genetic distance of 1 per marker matched above 52.


I know and study the Seymour's haplotypes from many years
108347 John Seymour (Seymer), B. ab. 1535 England R-BY3298
12 24 14 11 11-15 12 12 12 13 13 29 17 9-9 11 11 24 16 19 30 14-15-17-17 11 11 19-23 15 17 19 18 37-42 13 12 11 9 15-16 8 11 10 8 10 11 12 23-23 16 10 12 12 14 8 12 23 20 13 12 11 13 12 11 12 12 33 16 9 16 12 25 26 19 12 11 12 12 10 9 12 12 10 11 11 30 12 13 23 14 10 10 21 15 19 11 25 18 13 15 24 12 23 18 11 14 18 10 11 11
They are
_f3a3a. R1b-Z2103 > Z2106 > Z2109 > CTS7822 > CTS7556 > FGC29330
i.e. the English cluster of R-L23-Z2109-CTS7556, just after my R-L23-Z2110 (CTS7822)*.

Posts: 2283
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:08 am
Location: Pisa (Italy)
YDNA:
R- Z2110 (KV7Y2)
MtDNA:
K1a1b1e/HQ176413
PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2016 9:15 am
But this cluster CTS7556 is younger than mine (6100 as to YFUll, 7200 as to me)
R-CTS7556 Y18960 * CTS7556 * FGC29296+1 SNPs formed 6100 ybp, TMRCA 4800 ybp
and the English cluster is even younger
R-Y20344 FGC29330 * Y20345 * Y20344+21 SNPs formed 4800 ybp, TMRCA 1350 ybp

Posts: 2041
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:43 pm

MtDNA:
U5b2b
PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2016 11:18 am
Which of these has the oldest haplotype, KT5TU 67,8G44S 67,PWN78 67 and 94BBE 76? There is an Armenian/Turkey cluster at ysearch also. Was this Z2103 cluster the result of an expansion from Italy> Turkey> Armenia?

Posts: 2283
Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2012 7:08 am
Location: Pisa (Italy)
YDNA:
R- Z2110 (KV7Y2)
MtDNA:
K1a1b1e/HQ176413
PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2016 11:52 am
dartraighe wrote:Which of these has the oldest haplotype, KT5TU 67,8G44S 67,PWN78 67 and 94BBE 76? There is an Armenian/Turkey cluster at ysearch also. Was this Z2103 cluster the result of an expansion from Italy> Turkey> Armenia?


These persons are all SNP tested:
N37658 Angelo Romitti, 1840, Suzzara, Lombardy, Italy Italy R-Y5586
12 24 14 11 11-14 12 12 12 13 13 30 16 9-10 11 11 25 15 19 30 14-15-16-18 11 12 19-23 15 16 19 18 36-37 12 12 11 9 15-16 8 10 10 8 10 10 12 23-23 16 10 12 12 15 8 12 21 20 13 12 11 13 11 11 12 12
13660 Henry Hollingsworth (born 1598) County Armagh, Ire Ireland R-BY3297
12 24 14 11 11-14 12 12 12 14 13 30 16 9-10 11 11 25 15 19 30 15-16-16-18 11 11 19-23 15 16 20 18 36-38 12 12 11 9 15-16 8 10 10 8 10 11 12 22-23 17 10 12 12 15 8 12 21 20 14 12 11 13 11 11 12 13 35 15 9 16 11 28 26 19 12 11 13 12 10 9 12 12 10 12 11 30 12 13 24 14 10 10 20 15 21 12 24 17 12 15 24 12 23 18 10 14 16 9 11 11
B3248 Panchero , b. 1335 Val di Sole, Trentino Italy R-BY3297
12 24 14 11 11-14 12 12 13 14 12 30 16 9-10 11 11 25 15 19 31 14-15-16-18 11 11 19-23 15 16 20 17 37-38 12 12 11 9 15-16 8 10 10 8 10 11 12 22-23 16 10 12 12 15 8 12 21 20 13 12 11 13 11 11 12 12 33 15 9 16 12 28 26 19 12 11 13 12 10 9 12 12 10 12 11 30 12 13 24 14 10 10 19 15 21 13 24 18 12 15 24 12 23 18 10 14 17 9 11 11
Only the person submitted with the surname "Celestino" (which is an Italian surname) isn't.
The first series (15-10-12-12-14) from 16-10-12-12-15 is interesting.

About your question I think that we need more aDNA for answering that. Armenia and Caucasus have some haplotypes from Samara R-L23 and no older haplotypes has been found so far in the aDNA, but let's wait for other tests.
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